Bearcats Mean Business podcast

Grant Freking: (00:01)
Welcome back to Bearcats Mean Business. Today's guest is Matt Booher, vice President of Data Solutions at EW Scripps Company. Matt is one of two keynote speakers for the Center for Business Analytics upcoming Data Science Symposium, which is slated for Thursday, October 9th at Lindner Hall. The symposium's theme is AI and analytics in action. Matt's career path has taken him deep into the world of AI and analytics at Scripps, from navigating the fast changing media landscape to positioning his teams for the future, Matt has seen firsthand how data and technology are rewriting the rules of business. In today's episode, Matt and Center for Business Analytics executive director Georgette Angulo-Ramirez will explore Matt's journey into ai, his perspective on where data and analytics are taking the industry next, and preview his data science symposium keynote data goes live, how scripps is evolving, AI and analytics. Georgette and Matt will also dig into practical advice for students, including the skills to sharpen now the value of co-op experiences and how to turn opportunities into career momentum. Without further ado, here's Matt and Georgette.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (01:05)
Thank you very much. Grant, can you tell us a little bit about your role at Scripps and how you got into AI and analytics?

Matt Booher: (01:13)
Okay. Yeah. So my role at Scripps is VP of Data Solutions, and what that really means is just managing the data for the company and then managing the people and the processes where people interact with that data. Uh, that includes data governance, that includes data engineering, that includes data analytics, that includes, um, program management for the data initiatives. And then that requires deep collaboration with our infrastructure team, our cybersecurity team, our research team, and then just business leaders in general. So a lot coming at me on a daily basis.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (01:46)
Yes. So even, even more so grateful for you spending time with us. No problem. Um, as you were saying, you are basically in charge of every part of the business that needs to lead the journey of analytics and ai. And my question to you now is how has that journey evolved for Scripps and what have been some of the challenges that you faced?

Matt Booher: (02:09)
Yeah, so I've been with Scripps for 10 years. I began as director of digital analytics, which was really focused on the analytics needs of the business as it related to our digital products. So for us, digital products means mobile applications, connected TV applications, websites, and then relationships with our streaming distributors. So those partners that we work with, say Roku, Hulu, whomever, uh, managing the data that's being generated by our presence on those platforms, and then delivering that back to data leadership. Over time, that evolved into some first party data management work, uh, where we're working with our, um, sales organization to identify core audiences that are using our products and then work with them to develop targeted advertising strategies. And then subsequently, now just sort of in my evolution at the organization, I'm now responsible for not only that business facing aspect of the analytics operation, but also dealing with the backend management of all of that data.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (03:11)
So you just walked us through the journey as it entails, the data ingestion and how that has been just accumulating in terms of the challenges, as you said, the the backend, uh, the structure, the administration of that. What would you say has been the hardest part about that process and the order in which you guys have taken on?

Matt Booher: (03:39)
Yeah, so I think most people might answer the volume of data. I think in our industry, that's not necessarily the case being a broadcaster, what we're dealing with is the fragmentation of the data. And so what I mean by that is all of the different sources that we need to acquire data from to be able to pull all that together to either give, um, you know, the research team, the ability to provide a unified view of our audiences across all those different platforms. Uh, it might be dealing with the fragmentation of what we refer to as currency providers. So the ratings data that's associated with what we're doing on our linear business where we're actually broadcasting over the air through our local markets. We have 63, um, stations in about 45 markets. Don't quote me on that because it's , it's always changing. Um, and then our national network, so ion, ion plus, court tv, all of the fragmentation of that data and all of the different places where that programming is available. So we're dealing with just a large number of data providers. The data sets themselves may not be large or they may not be complex, but the complexities and the scale at which we're trying to operate and acquire that data, then transform it into something useful for the business. So for us, it's not necessarily, Hey, we have 10 billion records. It's more we have 80 or 90 data sources that we're trying to bring into a unified view, into a master data model, so that we can then easily distribute that data to our business partners as needed.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (05:20)
That sounds, uh, very tricky. And also it brings me back to times where I've had to work on different division data and having to make sense of how something as simple as how people decide to, uh, title their columns in a data set and how, you know, we, we've talked about this before, how somebody might spell out the company's name and somebody might use an abbreviation. And the amount of time that it takes for somebody to just go through that.

Matt Booher: (05:50)
We are in the middle of that right now. Uh, we deal that with programming data and we deal with that on advertising naming conventions. And I would would say that is one place where AI has presented an opportunity. Uh, we're doing string matching in a lot of instances. Uh, some, in some cases we're doing manual mapping of those names. And so we're looking at that as one of the, the key areas where we can apply some, some AI intelligence and some automation techniques to be able to clean up that data and get that into our master data model.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (06:19)
So aside from the, this issue of fragmentation, which is not, like you said, it's, it's the biggest that you see for your industry, but it's actually common for almost every single industry because not only are they taking data from different places, they're taking new sets of data constantly. How else do you see AI and analytics shaping or impacting the media industry?

Matt Booher: (06:43)
I don't even know where to start . Um, you know, I think that's a big challenge within our organization today. I think for us, it started with ethics. So being a broadcast company, being a journalism company, I think the first thing that we needed to do was understand what are the guardrails going to be? What, what are we going to maintain, um, how are we going to maintain our journalistic integrity on that side of the business from sort of the news gathering and journalism operation? And then how do we instruct or guide the employees of the organization to take advantage of the opportunity that AI presents maybe in their individual role or across their team, and help them understand what responsibilities they have, uh, to the company and to the company's data before they just start going out and spinning up, you know, firing up a chat GPT or firing up a clo and, you know, loading up , loading up a spreadsheet with our information in it, and then just sort of, you know, trying to get insight.

Matt Booher: (07:41)
It's all well intended. It's not being done in a malicious way, but having people understand what those governance principles are. So you have the journalism ethics piece, and then you sort of have the data governance piece that you really have to be thinking about. Um, and the way that we solved that at Scripps is we developed a, a tool called Engine Room. And so our AI group led by Christina Hartman and Carrie Oslan, they really sort of began this push to say, Hey, we want you to use this. We are encouraging you to use this. We don't know what the opportunities are, but those of you that are working with the data on a day-to-day basis, you could probably be very instructive in what, what we could do. So the first thing we did was just, uh, spin up an environment that was firewalled within our environment, leveraging the API capabilities of those AI modeling companies and say, play, just see what you can do, see what you can figure out. Uh, and you know, that's been, that's been very useful, that's been very useful. And it's allowed us to identify a number of different use cases, one that we can identify, um, low effort, high productivity opportunities with ai. And then the second thing is using all of that different activity to inform what might be able to be done at scale that we're not currently able to do today.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (08:56)
Really appreciate you bringing up the points of ethics, because I have a daughter in college right now and she's taking an ethics class, and the first thing she said is, I did not know this was going to be so hard. Um, so, which I think it's, it's so true. Uh, so much reading and so much thinking deep. Would you say, uh, for students who are preparing to enter fields where, and I don't know any field that will not be impacted by ai, what would you be their recom your recommendation for how they prepare themselves to enter the workforce?

Matt Booher: (09:30)
Uh, I would start with the ethics piece. I would, I would understand that if you're entering into the workforce, there are certain responsibilities and obligations you have to the, to your employer, particularly if they're a publicly traded company that you need to be aware of and be thinking about when you do your job on a daily basis. You know, there's the, there's the foundational piece, which are the skills, and that's, that's why you go to school. That's why you get the education so that you have that foundation. I think a lot of students make the mistake of coming into the workplace with those skills and not recognize that that's just the beginning. That that's the foundation.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (10:06)
Table stakes.

Matt Booher: (10:07)
It's, it's gonna get you through the door mm-hmm . But then how you conduct yourself when you're in the building is really going to be the differentiator for you in terms of whether or not you're going to be able to grow your career or move your career in a certain direction. Uh, the skills themselves just facilitate that, and it's how you apply them, and it's how you conduct yourself in the workplace. It's going to make a significant difference in, in where your career ends up going.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (10:30)
That is so true. We, we even, um, had a conversation just recently with one of our members of the CBA and uh, asking them, what do they, what are you looking for in students that are going to be, uh, in a co-op or interim, uh, program? And they said, in addition to the basics, uh, which are being able to do the job, um, I want students with, uh, strong emotional intelligence. And so there goes something that, again, we, we don't, perhaps don't give enough credit, but it does make a difference in the workplace. Experiential learning and co-op is a big piece of how Lindner prepares students for their, their lifelong journey. How, how would you recommend students turn those experiences into learning for their professional careers?

Matt Booher: (11:16)
I know that when I was in college, the number one assignment that I hated the most was a group project . I hated them. There's so much chaos, there's so much confusion. Where are you gonna meet? When are you gonna meet? What are we agreeing on to deliver for our final project? All those types of things are exactly what the business and workplace is all about.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (11:40)
Yeah. What part of your day isn't a group project?

Matt Booher: (11:43)
Correct. Right. And so that, that's the biggest challenge with young people coming into the workplace, is explaining to them and helping, helping them understand that that is the work, your expertise. I'm already assuming that to be true. Your expertise, what you know, what you know technically, uh, what you might know statistically, what you might know, um, from a, from a industry standpoint or what, what, what works and what doesn't work. I'm already assuming that to be true. And then it's really about how are you collaborating with your peers. I always tell, I always tell folks, if you don't comment your code or you don't leave something behind for someone to be able to follow up on and finish it's science fair project, it doesn't create value for the company. You did it. That's great. I'm not gonna give you a grade. What I wanna know is, can we pick up where you left off and move it forward?

Matt Booher: (12:36)
Or if I have to shift work in the department, can someone else pick up where you left off? Did you leave enough behind for them to understand how they can move this forward? So those types of things, that's, I think that's where I see students struggle the most when they enter the workplace, is understanding those dynamics and how to navigate those appropriately and not just say like, Hey, look what I did. Isn't this fantastic? Yes. Now if I handed it off to, uh, someone else on the team, or I handed it off to a business partner, do they know what's going on? So that, that I think is, is absolutely essential that students need to take away from this conversation, is that those skills and that technological expertise and that talent that they do have is just the beginning. Is just the beginning.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (13:24)
That's a great perspective and something that I'm going to share. I'm gonna share this podcast episode with my kids because they need to hear it not just from me , but also from somebody that's been

Matt Booher: (13:34)
Somebody that's hiring

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (13:35)
That has been really successful in this field and hiring. Yes. Um, let's move on to the big event that we are all working to put together on October 9th, which is our data science symposium. You have been kind enough to agree to be one of our keynote speakers. We're super excited. You're gonna bring some real talk, is how I, I like to describe it to people based on our interactions. Um, what, how could you, how would you describe what they can expect from your keynote?

Matt Booher: (14:05)
So I think the keynote is gonna focus on a couple of things. I think the first thing it's gonna focus on is the evolution of the data space kind of began as a centralized BI operation. And then we got into data science and we developed all these capabilities where you could have full stack developers. Then it became an operational thing where you wanted to scale those activities of those data science through like machine learning ops and, and things like that. And now we're faced with this AI challenge, and if you skipped any of those steps along the way, you're gonna have a hard time with ai. You just need to know that you're continually building your foundation and while the thing that comes out the other side might be sexy and really appealing and gets get, gets the business folks excited or the leadership excited, uh, it's going to be really flimsy if you're not laying down that foundation.

Matt Booher: (14:53)
And then thinking really, really hard about what the employees are doing and what they need to do their jobs. Uh, look, there's a lot of talk out there about how a AI is gonna take jobs that like, it's going to gut entry level positions. I don't necessarily, my personal perspective is I don't necessarily see that happening because everything that we do in our organization has a human in the loop. Uh, that might mean your job changes, that might mean your job evolves. Uh, and that that's what the keynote's gonna talk about is like what are those practical things you need to think about? Look, there's the theory, there's the technology, there's all the cool things we can do, but really at the end of the day, it's how do you make that work, and in an organization.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (15:32)
I think everyone will really be, um, he ready to hear that. And especially from folks in the field, folks who are not only experiencing being part of the journey, but leading it. Mm-hmm . So really appreciate you saying that. And, uh, just to, to wrap up, if people can take one thing away from this episode, what would that be?

Matt Booher: (15:54)
Well, I think I touched on it. I think, um, the foundations are just the beginning. Mm-hmm . Everything you learn. Look, you can be a great coder, you can be a great technician. You can understand infrastructure, you can optimize your infrastructure. You can do all these really cool things with the technologies that are available to us today. Uh, but you have to consider the people part of what you're doing. And then you have to consider the fact that you're doing that in an organization that is looking to you to create value for that organization. And so those two other things that I'm talking about from the people collaboration standpoint and the value creation standpoint are, are basically the three legs of the stool to borrow, you know, a worn out business analogy. Mm-hmm . Right? You got the technical piece, you have the people piece, uh, but then you have to be thinking about what value you're creating.

Georgette Angulo-Ramirez: (16:43)
Absolutely. And, uh, value is influence. And I think that's what most people are looking to achieve in their lifetime, is to be able to influence those who work around them. Mm-hmm .

Grant Freking: (16:53)
That's a wrap on today's episode of Bearcats Mean Business. Thank you to Georgette for hosting and to Matt Booher for coming on to share his expertise. A friendly reminder to register for the upcoming Data Science Symposium on October 9th at the Carl H. Lindner College of Business. Visit business.uc.edu/data-science to register. That's business.uc.edu/data-science to register. Be sure to subscribe. Leave a review and share this episode with someone who's ready to take the leap at Lindner. Your feedback helps more Bearcats discover the show. Until next time, keep showing the world how Bearcats mean business.

Grant Freking: (00:00)
Welcome back to Bearcats Mean Business. Today's guest has a story that blends ambition, resilience, and a co-op experience that illustrates the opportunities available to Lindner students who are ready to seize them. Bitanya Derese, a fourth year marketing major and Lindner business honors student, recently completed a co-op with Google in San Francisco. In this conversation we'll hear how Lindner and uc experiences shaped Bitanya's readiness, how she overcame challenges in a high stakes environment, and what she learned at Google that she's carrying forward with her into her classes and future career. And there's much more to her story. Bitanya came to the US from Ethiopia when she was just three years old in the years since she's found ways to give back to her home country while excelling here at Lindner and uc. Bitanya, welcome.

Bitanya Derese: (00:45)
Hi.

Grant Freking: (00:46)
Thanks for being here. It feels just like yesterday. We were talking offline before we went live here. Just like yesterday. You were first year student helping my team out with a video project. Where's the time go?

Bitanya Derese: (00:54)
I know, it's crazy. I can't believe I'm already a senior.

Grant Freking: (00:57)
It is crazy. It is wild. Time goes too fast. All right, let's get right into it. Google, you recently completed a paid professional experience, what we are here at Lindner, referred to as a co-op. Mm-hmm . With Google and I have so many questions. First, how did you obtain this co-op?

Bitanya Derese: (01:10)
Yeah, um, I think that's a layered question. I think in terms of how I obtained the co-op, there was a lot of work on the back end. I think the biggest thing I did before I actually applied and got the co-op was a lot of resume prep. Um, and I got a lot of help from different resources. So whether that was like career services or the different clubs I'm in, like the um, Varsity sales team or business fellows and so on. I think making sure that my resume like stood out immediately when I applied was my number one goal. So I think on the back end it was about like crafting my resume. But in terms of actually obtaining it, um, I submitted my application the first day. The application dropped. Um,

Grant Freking: (01:51)
Got in, got in there early.

Bitanya Derese: (01:53)
I did. So I think that was pretty straightforward. But yeah, like I said, I think the resume prep was like my biggest um, backend work I did before I actually applied and then obtained the co-op.

Grant Freking: (02:01)
And then what was the, was there an interview process correlated with this interview? How did that go?

Bitanya Derese: (02:06)
Yeah, so after I applied I, 'cause I was in the interview process so I was obviously interviewing with other companies and so on. Um, so I applied and then I heard back I think like three weeks later. Um, and at that point I was already in the midst of like final stages for other companies and it kind of like threw me off. So I was like, oh wow, now I have to consider this. Because I honestly didn't even think that it was gonna go anywhere. It was kind of like a shot in the dark, like, oh, if I don't get it, no big deal. I'm already interviewing with other companies anyways, but on some crazy chance if I get it then we'll have to go from there. And I mean that's kind of what the reality was. So I applied heard back three weeks later. I had to like submit my availability of what times I was open to interview and it was just 2 45-minute interviews. I think people think, I don't know, since it's Google you're, you need, you know, a background check. I mean I did need a background check but just some extensive complicated um, steps. But after I got the interview it was just to interview. I have to give them my availability 2 45 minutes and I got the offer.

Grant Freking: (03:05)
Oh it just go show apply. You never know what can happen.

Bitanya Derese: (03:07)
Yeah. Yes. It was such a quick turnaround I feel like, and like I said, I think like having my resume stand out was like really what streamlined me into this process. Um, because yeah, I submitted my application, did two interviews back to back same day. And then I actually got the call the same day, like two hours later that I got the offer. So it was pretty much like a packed up process in 24 hours.

Grant Freking: (03:28)
That's quick. And then immediately you're thinking about like where am I gonna live in San Francisco? Yes. So what was, what was your role at Google and what did your day to day look like? 'cause you were on the ground in San Francisco on Google at Google's campus.

Bitanya Derese: (03:39)
Yeah. Um, so my day-to-day, so I guess to start my role at Google was um, essentially an account strategist. So I helped um, about like 120 small and medium sized businesses, um, handle their Google Ads account. So these are already existing Google customers. And what I did was hop on calls with them, like strategize, you know, areas of growth we had in their companies and how they're already using Google ads and like potential they had to grow it and what I could do internally as like a Google expert quote unquote like to help them build their businesses. Um, so yeah, I was an account strategist and my day to day pretty much looked like sending out emails, cold calling here and there. Um, and then a lot of client calls. So once you send out the emails you get a lot of responses of like, this is one I can meet, I can meet now. And then like cold calling, sometimes these clients would be like, yeah, I'm super slammed. Do you have time right now? And it'd just be like on the fly selling them what you were gonna sell them or just like talking to them about their account because like obviously with sales there's gonna be skeptical people, people who don't wanna talk and so on. So I think a lot of my day to day was definitely just like client interaction.

Grant Freking: (04:44)
Sure. And how did your, your previous experiences and they may or may not be correlated to what you've learned here at Lindner, your clubs, organizations as well as whatever else you've been involved in, uc and maybe even your previous co-op experiences. How did it all help you as an account strategist at Google?

Bitanya Derese: (04:58)
Yeah, um, for sure. I think, like I said, on the back end of applying and getting the role, just having a very like handcrafted resume that stood out was definitely the thing that helped me. Um, but from my past experiences, I think all the clubs that I'm in, the sales team, business fellows, Lindner ambassadors and so on just made me seem like oh she definitely talks to people on her day to day. So it's not just a role she's applying for. And I'm a waitress as well like part-time. So I think all of my experiences that I do like, um, like in real life show that I'm very passionate about sales. So that made me stand out. And then um, before Google I actually kind of did a similar role at Dell Technologies and I think them seeing that I had a similar experience with another big tech company was almost just like a okay, so she's definitely interested in this. Um, and I think it showed them that I could succeed in the role. Um, and even with Dell, that was somebody I knew that already co-op'd in Lindner, I reached out to them, I reached out to to career services and so on. So I think a combination of all of like my extracurricular experiences. Yeah. Plus the past internships I had made me like stand out as a candidate to them.

Grant Freking: (06:04)
Absolutely. Yeah. So we've talked a little bit about sort of like the hard skills and sort of like the day-to-day you've done. How did your time at Google test and develop your soft skills, the stuff that maybe it's not in the textbooks and you kinda have to learn on your own through your own experiences?

Bitanya Derese: (06:17)
Yeah, I think with corporate America everybody has like different experiences. I think with Google, especially when you're not at Google yet, it makes you think like wow, like this is a company, everybody knows this is big tech. Like am I gonna need to wear, you know, a blazer every day and be just all my Ps and Qs? Like I want a full-time role. But for Google specifically, their culture is so like they encourage your authentic self and it's so relaxed. I don't think I even wore like a blazer one time. They're very like down to their attire, down to their talk. Like they really foster like a growth environment but they want to see you advocate yourself 'cause they don't want like a robot there. They want to see you be your true self. Um, so in terms of my soft skills, I think adapting to corporate America, I learned how to like genuinely be myself at Google, which was experience that I really valued. Um, and then I think communication is kind of the biggest soft skill overall that you can't really like learn in textbooks. I think talking to clients is one side because there's the client facing side of you and then there's you in your work environment and how you interact with your friends and leader like leadership and people above you. So I think just crafting myself to be very like multi-sided and adapt to who I'm talking to in terms of communication is like the biggest I learned from them.

Grant Freking: (07:34)
Sure. What about when I say challenges at Google, what sticks out to you? What was, you know, maybe it was a, a soft skill conflict, a hard skill conflict, not conflict a challenge. And how did, how did you approach that challenge? Or maybe it was a set of challenges that was related to maybe a client or a particular meeting that you were had at Google?

Bitanya Derese: (07:52)
Yeah, I think in terms of my role specifically and really just in the sales world, there's a lot of challenges in, the biggest one that probably comes to mind for people is that you do have like a target and quota over your head. So there's no certainty and like what you're doing and that you're able to hit these goals and target in quota. So you really have to be like resilient and bounce back without people telling you to necessarily because you knew what you signed up for and you knew that there was gonna be this number you had to hit or um, something that you had to sell. In terms of challenges, I think the biggest one that I faced all summer was timing out. Like when I was gonna hit my target in quota and there was a lot of uncontrollables for me. Like for example, you would schedule a meeting with a client and in your head you're like, okay, this is how the game plan is gonna go.

Bitanya Derese: (08:37)
This is gonna reach me to this point of my quota and then something came up and then they cancel on you shifts. Yeah. And it would be like that every week, every other day. So you almost had to schedule double the amount of people you wanted to ideally talk to because half of them probably would no show or something would come up or they would forget and then it would just throw you off. And when you do have like a goal or target you have to reach over your head that essentially kind of measures your success. You kind of have to be the one on top of things that like plan three strides ahead. 'cause if you don't, you really do fall behind. Like by the time you know it, the end, the end of the internship has come, you haven't hit your target and then you're freaking out. So you really have to be ahead of um, the strides in terms of time management and planning. So that was like a big challenge I had to overcome.

Grant Freking: (09:20)
Yeah, that's some real world, real world experience there, that's for sure. So what did you learn at Google that you have since brought back in, you know, almost a month in the fall semester classes here that you've brought back and applied to your classes or maybe, you know, future co-ops and you being a senior, maybe even a future position. What have you brought back for to, to learn and to take forward with you?

Bitanya Derese: (09:40)
Um, I think like the biggest skill that I was actively working on that I feel like I really hammered down at Google was active listening. Um, like I said in sales it seems very straightforward if you're just trying to sell something and it's like, feels almost very transactional. But I didn't necessarily love that. I think something that I struggle with, especially when you're in sales and when you have a tendency to talk a lot, it's almost like you're just talking conveying your point and then, you know, you keep the cycle going. But active listening was something that I feel like I struggled with and you know, like taking a second, letting somebody convey their full thoughts to me. Picking it up and seeing where I can go from there. Um, so talking with so many clients over the summer, I think like, and with the one-on-ones that I did with my manager and like these were goals that I told him early on.

Bitanya Derese: (10:22)
Like, I wanna work on listening 'cause I know sales isn't just, you know, me pitching something and me just letting all my thoughts out and then that's it. Um, so I think that's something I actively worked on all summer and I definitely took it back with me because now I'm transitioning it into whether I'm waitressing. Like I just had a shift last night and I feel like I'm already like listening to my customers and taking a second to breathe and not necessarily be the one that's jumping to talk, but letting the other person convey what they want and then using that to like, um, help them out.

Grant Freking: (10:52)
Absolutely. What advice would you have for other Lindner students who perhaps wanna emulate your path or wanna seek a big name opportunities like Google besides doing the actual application work? What other advice would you give them?

Bitanya Derese: (11:04)
I think, and this might sound cliche and you might hear it from a lot of people, but is honestly just get involved as much as you can. Okay. Advice that I've had early on, and I still stand with it for underclassmen, is that, especially in Lindner, you are genuinely going to receive the input that you give in. So if you really just don't do much, um, and you just expect opportunities like this to fall in your lap, unfortunately that is not the case and you're kind of sadly mistaken. So by getting involved and like thinking about your resume early on and thinking about steps of like, how am I going to get to these big name opportunities, that's really gonna be your best friend. And especially Lindner, they have so many resources, like there's probably not a question that will go unanswered for you at Lindner, we actually have like so many resources that I probably don't even know of still, but the ones that I have been able to access have helped me out so much. And for me it was really two pillars of like career services on one hand, Lindner, business honors on the other hand, and then just all of the extracurriculars I would do, like I said, business, fellow, sales team, et cetera. Um, I think that really set me up to craft my resume and stand out to them as a candidate.

Grant Freking: (12:09)
If you could go back to your first year at Lindner, which again seems like yesterday, like we discussed , what would you tell yourself about preparing for opportunities like this?

Bitanya Derese: (12:18)
Um, I think I would tell myself that it will all work out. I think in college and especially like right now in this generation specifically, there's so much stress we put on ourselves to immediately come in and hit the ground running. And I was super involved in high school and I feel like that's how I was when I came in freshman year, which that's definitely a good thing and I'm not saying to ignore that, but honestly like you need to breathe, still enjoy your college life because you have four years. And now that I'm a senior, I actually can't believe like I'm done with school and I have to just like hop into corporate America or wherever my path takes me next and it actually like races by. So I think for myself, the advice I would give is like, the time is gonna pass anyways.

Bitanya Derese: (12:57)
Like make sure you have a good balance of putting that effort in. Um, trying hard, but also relaxing and having fun because burnout is very real. And if your only goal that you come in with is having, you know, insane high opportunities, I mean is that's such a good goal, but at the end of the day you're gonna look back and be like, wow, like what else did I do in college? And I don't think that's a healthy dynamic to have. So to myself I would probably just say, have your fun and do what you've been doing work hard because apparently nothing's unattainable and even somebody like me can get Google, which I did not think was the case my freshman year.

Grant Freking: (13:32)
Oh, that was certainly the case. I I knew it all along . So what does your day-to-day life look like as, as a fourth year Lindner student? What are you kind of b you bouncing, you know, career prospects, your coursework, you're involved in clubs, you've mentioned you have a part-time job, so what does your day-to-day life look like?

Bitanya Derese: (13:47)
Yeah. Um, so right now my current load, I am taking all online classes. Um, because I knew that once fall comes my priorities would be, um, spending a lot of my time job hunting, being through interview processes, um, figuring out what I want to do with my life post grad. Um, and then yes, I did say I have a part-time job. I've been waitressing throughout my whole college experience. Um, that's just to make me a little like extra money on the side, which obviously is a college student. Like, you need that 'cause who else is gonna give you the money? Um, so I think I decided to do online classes just so I could have a good dynamic of searching for jobs, making money on the side, and then still having time for my extracurriculars and like fun outside of school.

Grant Freking: (14:28)
Absolutely. Let's transition a little bit. Can we talk a little bit about your background? You moved from Ethiopia to the United States when you were just three years old. Why did your parents and your family had decided to make that move? Yeah,

Bitanya Derese: (14:38)
Um, like you said, so my family and I came over to the States in 2007. Um, and in terms of why we came over, I think it was just that typical American dream that most immigrants kind of hope for and wish for for their children. So we came over, um, and the goal was so that me and my siblings could pursue higher education. Okay. So even Ethiopia, that's just high school and on. So I think grade school is like the typical there, but some kids don't even go to high school and there's like, you know, low rates of literacy there. So I think having just bigger opportunities to go to school, get good jobs, et cetera, is why my parents came over. Um, and after this year we will all be a college grads, so really happy about that. Um, and then I think when I reflect back to just like kind of like life as an immigrant and coming over, I think there's obviously so many layers of being an immigrant and there's like culture that I deal with back home being bilingual and so on.

Bitanya Derese: (15:34)
But in terms of my college experience, I think that is kind of my motivation to get me these high opportunities. I think I always think about the sacrifice my parents made, you know, dropping their whole lives in Ethiopia just so I could go to school and pursue bigger opportunities. And to me big is not big enough, so I'm like, how can I really, you know, outdo myself and, you know, opportunities like Google and Dell and so on for me is a testament to my parents' hard work. So I think above all else being rooted, um, as the daughter of Ethiopian immigrants makes me always remember kind of like my why and why I'm doing it and why I always want to achieve more for myself. So I think that's definitely a big motivation factor for me.

Grant Freking: (16:14)
Tell me about your decision to start raising money for your home country. What, what do you, what do you do? What goes into it? Yeah.

Bitanya Derese: (16:20)
Yeah. So I started, um, a organization when I was a sophomore in high school. Um, in terms of kind of what it does, I go around the Cincinnati area, um, usually from schools, whether that be grade schools, high schools and so on, and kind of fundraise. So I went to, um, a private high school and grade school and obviously, you know, that it's like uniform based. So a lot of like my ideas back then were like, you know, paid outta uniforms or stuff like that where it would be a good cause they could pay a couple of dollars to come outta uniform. And that, um, raised me a big bunch of my, um, donations. And then when I got to college, I knew I would have to shift up a little bit from there. We, um, started fundraising in college and I knew I had to change up my approach a bit.

Bitanya Derese: (17:08)
Hmm. So I used, um, uc clubs and organizations to fundraise and I did fundraise me a good amount of money when I got to college as well. So 2021, it was right before I got to college actually. I took a trip back home to Ethiopia and that was the first time I had been since I've been born. Okay. Um, and what I raised in high school, I was able to give back to those children in person. And the direct I work with that is in Ethiopia that helps. Um, it's almost like an orphanage slash school in Ethiopia and that's where the money goes to. Um, so it was just a crazy experience for me seeing kind of like, even though that's not necessarily where I was born and where I came from because I'm, um, I was born in the city in Ethiopia. Mm-hmm . Seeing that like 30, 40 minutes down the drive there are kids in like extreme poverty was really just touching.

Bitanya Derese: (17:55)
And I think above all else, it made me live kind of my life in gratitude. And that's like anybody knows about me, that's kind of like a pillar that I live my life by. I have a tattoo that says grateful because the foundation in itself is called the Grateful Foundation. Um, and I think going there and seeing those experiences and unfortunate circumstances in real life made me realize like even though I'm from there, I also suffer from like first world problems and so on. And it just made me think holistically, like, wow, there is so much worse going on in the world. And it kind of made me very grateful for my experiences that I get to have in the states.

Grant Freking: (18:29)
Hmm. Thank you for sharing that. Yeah. Let's close with some rapid fire questions. Okay. All right. Number one, what's your go-to restaurant or dining hall?

Bitanya Derese: (18:37)
OTG.

Grant Freking: (18:38)
Okay. That's on the green. That is on the green. On the green, yeah. Yeah. For those who don't know, number two, the business world is full of buzzwords, we both know this. What's a business, what buzzword that you actually secretly love?

Bitanya Derese: (18:49)
Um, I think circle back.

Grant Freking: (18:51)
Circle back? Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I'm a big fan of that one too. . All right. Number three, what song instantly makes you feel happy and inspired?

Bitanya Derese: (18:58)
Um, I like the song Good Days by SZA.

Grant Freking: (19:01)
Okay. Number four. What's an accomplishment? Maybe aside from Google or you can say this one too. What's an accomplishment of yours that you are very proud of?

Bitanya Derese: (19:08)
Um, I think being on Dean's list since I've been here since my freshman year, so I don't even know how many quarters it's been now, but being in Dean's list all of my years here, that's

Grant Freking: (19:16)
A great accomplishment. . All right. Number five, one word to describe your time. Studying business at Lindner

Bitanya Derese: (19:22)
Rewarding.

Grant Freking: (19:23)
That's a wrap on today's episode of Bearcats Being Business. A huge thank you to Bitanya Derese for sharing her journey from co-oping at Google to giving back to her home country, and for showing us how Lindner students can turn big dreams into bold opportunities. Be sure to subscribe, leave a review and share this episode with someone who's ready to take the leap at Lindner. Your feedback helps more Bearcats discover the show. Until next time, keep showing the world how Bearcats mean business.

Grant Freking: (00:00)
Every Bearcat has a story, but some stories remind us exactly why hard work, persistence, and a little bit of risk taking can change everything. Today's guest, Bobby Shuckmann, proves that a big dream backed by focus and relentless effort can turn into a career that once felt out of reach. Bobby knew early on that he wanted to work in sports. That dream wasn't easy and it wasn't guaranteed. But through smart career choices, a willingness to invest in himself and a co-op experience that demanded more than most people would dare take on, he built the foundation for long-term success. In our conversation today, Bobby will share how an unpaid co-op with the Indiana Pacers became a defining chapter in his career. The lessons gained from picking a craft and excelling at it, and the mindset it takes to break into a competitive industry. Welcome, Bobby. Thanks for joining me today.

Bobby Schuckmann: (00:50)
Good morning. Thanks for having me.

Grant Freking: (00:52)
Of course. Now, Bobby, for those who don't know you, what do you do and how do you describe the moment you are in right now, professionally?

Bobby Schuckmann: (01:00)
Well, first I'm a, a proud west sider. I grew up in Cincinnati, went to Oak Hills High School, um, and eventually married my, my wife, uh, while I went to, went to uc as well. Um, so I'm proud, proud Bearcat, um, proud, um, uc sports fan. Um, I have a 15-year-old daughter and a 12-year-old son. Uh, so it's, it's crazy to think about the conversations I'm having now with my daughter about college and reflecting back on 20 plus years. And, you know, and here we are. Uh, my, my career today, uh, for the past 20 years has been in the wealth management space as a wealth advisor and private banker, uh, primarily to professional athletes, coaches, uh, team executives and bus business centers in this space. Um, so it's been fun to, uh, reflect on, on the journey that I've been, and I try not to, to forget what it was like starting out at uc and, and not necessarily having a game plan to where I am today, and being very thankful for my time at uc. Uh, and for, for Dean Lewis for getting me here.

Grant Freking: (01:57)
Now you got right to Dean Lewis. And that was my first question. Now, Dean Lewis mentioned to me recently that you had this dream of a career in sports while you were a student at Lindner, the old Lindner Hall. We all know a lot of people have that dream, but it's not so easy to get in this to the business, especially in the sports business. When did you know you wanted to work in sports, and why did you want to get into the field?

Bobby Schuckmann: (02:17)
So I started out going to, to uc. I was fortunate to get into the, you know, to the business school and didn't really have a, a plan other than I'm gonna go to school, uh, do the co-op program and, and hopefully get a job when I'm done. There wasn't a, a game plan in place. Um, I was really figuring things out, um, on my own. And I have a, a twin sister who went to, uh, to uc as well, and graduated from the business school. And we were just figuring things out, um, along the way. And I, I did a three rounds of co-op, um, you know, midway through my, my journey. And that's when I started thinking more about, all right, where do I wanna find a, an area that I have a deep interest in. And like many of the students I speak to today, you know, I love sports.

Bobby Schuckmann: (02:55)
I enjoyed business, you know, how could I combine the two and did not have a game plan, uh, of any sort of, of what I should be doing, where I should get to. Um, you know, back then, you know, uh, 20 plus years ago, there was not many sports business internships or, or co-ops even available. And, um, I had to, to try to go out and find those opportunities on my own. Um, and so yeah, I'm, I'm very fortunate, so to be where I am today, because I did not have a, a plan in place whatsoever to get to where I want to be.

Grant Freking: (03:26)
Now, what did people around you say back then when you told them about your dream about being in sports?

Bobby Schuckmann: (03:31)
It was, it was a mixture. Um, you know, my, my family of course, were very supportive of it. Uh, Dean Lewis was, was very supportive. I think she, she knew how hard this was going to to be, uh, for a career field for the opportunities that are out there, for ones that actually may pay you a, a reasonable, uh, living. Um, but she, she wanted to support me if I was a hundred percent on board. And I, I remember, um, you know, going to meet with her to, to talk about this and just how supportive she was and, and it, it didn't feel like I was making a wrong decision. Um, you know, looking back, uh, I'm glad things worked out the way that they did. But, you know, going from faring my way to, to go to school, um, I commuted my first year. I was eventually living on campus and to then to take a, a, a job, um, you know, a co-op where I was going to not get paid. I was not going to get school credit. Um, I was still going to the school part-time that summer and working some side jobs to make some money. It was not the ideal scenario, but, uh, glad glad that I pursued that and it was, um, something that will last me forever.

Grant Freking: (04:33)
Right. Now, we'll get to that co-op in a second, but I wanna go back to the specific advice that maybe Dean Lewis gave to you that stuck with you. And I think maybe the conversation started with, are you sure?

Bobby Schuckmann: (04:44)
Yes. Um, I, I, I think, I thought I was, I was probably so naive to think that, oh, like I, I can do this, right? Um, not knowing how hard it was was going to be. And so, you know, sports is such a broad area, like, I wanna work in sports. Well, what does that mean? And I think at the time it was, I wanna work maybe for a college, for a sports team, you know, eventually start looking into, um, you know, brands like Nike or Adidas. Um, I had no idea that specializing in the sports industry within wealth management was even a career option for me, even though I was, you know, a finance major initially and, and thought I had interest in that space. So it really helped me start to think more narrowly about what skills do I need? What kind of job, what I want, want to have?

Bobby Schuckmann: (05:29)
Um, you know, what's the, the requirement and the experience to maybe get there. Um, you're, you're now opening yourself up to the nation, right? Or globally, right, of where these jobs are. There's only so many sports teams or companies and, and, you know, especially, you know, bigger cities may have more opportunities such as Atlanta, where I am today, or New York or LA. And I never thought about any of that in, in that sort of way. So she really helped me try to think about things more strategically from, from a, you know, a business mindset to not get so over, um, excited about being in sports necessarily. And really to start, build, building the skills and the experience I needed to get to where I want to go.

Grant Freking: (06:08)
What was the scariest or maybe the most uncertain moment in this journey for you, and what sort of pushed you through it? Was it sort of the optimism that you kind of referenced there?

Bobby Schuckmann: (06:17)
Originally, it was the optimism. As I start getting into the, the sports side of things, I, I got a, a quick understanding of how hard it was going to be. Um, even if you had all the skills, even if you had all the experience, uh, such as many things in, in life, you needed to know the right people. And I did not have that, that background. I did not have so much, such as myself to, to lean on for, um, advice. Um, and that was a very, very, uh, I think challenging part, um, of, you do so much work, you think you're doing all the right things, and it still may not be good enough. But I think to be successful in life, you, you can't take the approach that, you know, is this worth it or not? You, you have to know in your heart that if you do the right things and you work hard, maybe it's not the exact thing you had in mind when you started, but good things will come. And I think that's definitely been not the case for myself.

Grant Freking: (07:09)
Now, the co-op was one part of this, but you also were, were going to school here. So what was, what discipline did you choose when you were, uh, at Lindner, and why, and how did you work on becoming, you know, excellent in that discipline?

Bobby Schuckmann: (07:21)
Yeah, so I, I first chose finance as, as my discipline. And, but the technology maybe at the time isn't what the students are experiencing today. But, you know, going in and, um, you know, sitting in a large, uh, large classroom and with the, the projector screens, it was, it was not as exciting to me. Again, my idea what I thought finance was and what it really is, was different. Um, and it wasn't until I started getting experience in the finance space where I realized my perception of the, the role and the roles in the industry are very different, um, than what I thought they were. So I, uh, started out in finance and, and actually switched over to marketing, uh, thinking that would be a different journey. But it was really through my, my co-op experience is what gave me the, the most insight. You know, the, the classes were helpful, but it was definitely the on-hand experience, um, that I had there. And, you know, I, I think now as I, uh, you know, reconnected more and more with, with Dean Lewis and the business school the past several years, and hearing about all the opportunities and all the different programs within the business school, let alone the university, it, it does make me a little jealous of, of what these students are experiencing today. Um, but it, it definitely was something where I had to learn, uh, through experience. I had to learn through kind of trial and error to really understand what I wanted to do.

Grant Freking: (08:39)
Yeah. Let's talk about that co-op, the Pacers, Indianapolis, no pay, and a daily road trip of, what is it, three, three hours roughly from,

Bobby Schuckmann: (08:49)
I think it was about an hour and 40 minutes each way, um,

Bobby Schuckmann: (08:52)
Depending on traffic.

Grant Freking: (08:53)
Yeah. So walk us back to the day you, where you, you, we mentioned this earlier, but you did tell Dean Lewis, I have sort of, it was like a good news, bad news scenario. I have this amazing opportunity, but I'm gonna have to drive there every day and I'm not gonna get paid for it. Tell us about that.

Bobby Schuckmann: (09:07)
Yeah, I'm, I'm sure she was wondering why are you leaving a, a paid co-op, uh, positions, um, you know, again, to go work, uh, for free, um, and then drive, you know, um, an hour and 45 minutes, you know, each day. Um, and so, um, you know, it was a unique opportunity. I, I actually attended a, a workshop that the Pacers had held. Um, it was through another, uh, fraternity brother of mine and a, a a business school student, uh, Ben Zimmerman, uh, who told me about this. And he, um, brought me along, uh, to this, uh, career fair. And I applied thinking, there's no way I'm gonna get hired. And, and, um, and eventually I had to figure out, figure out the rest. But I think it was just the willingness to, uh, take on that, that opportunity where she could, she could see that I really wanted to, to, to make this an option for myself. Um, I think, you know, by being, uh, willing to do this, I think it showed I was willing to, to do what it took to, to be successful or at least put in the effort, uh, and do things that many people wouldn't do. And I think she could see how much I wanted this, that she was so supportive of it. 'cause she really knew that I was willing to not be in love with the idea of sports. I was really willing to do the work.

Grant Freking: (10:21)
Right. So what exactly were you doing during this co-op, and what did you gain and learn from this experience beyond a, a really nice looking entry in your resume?

Bobby Schuckmann: (10:30)
So this was a game operations, uh, internship role that summer with the Indiana Fever for game operations, um, where we actually worked the games, and then we were also doing off season, you know, marketing and events, uh, for the Indiana Pacers as well. Uh, so, you know, you would work, uh, you know, maybe a 930 to five o'clock shift, um, let's call it, uh, you know, four to five days a week. And then you would also, uh, work the Indiana Fever games. And so it could be when you're walking through the concourse, uh, ahead of time, of all the fan interaction, it could be what's going on, uh, at the timeout, you know, this is, you know, this is entertainment happens to be basketball, um, or, you know, whatever sport that you're working in, but you're really in the entertainment space. And so it was fun because we got to be very hands on with the opportunities.

Bobby Schuckmann: (11:16)
Um, we, you know, we would take, uh, the mascots to different appearances and see how, how they interact with people and, um, and learn kind of how they got there. And, you know, I have, you know, you know, we actually shared our little cubicle area with the, with a couple of the mascots and learned about how they got into the space and what they did. And, um, it was just a really hands-on where you felt like you were doing, you know, kind of meaningful work and you weren't just, um, you know, filling envelopes all day long, which may be some of the other folks were doing in different internship roles. Um, and so that, that it was really fun and exciting, but also a lot of work, a lot of long hours. And it really started to have me look at things differently than just working for a sports team.

Grant Freking: (11:57)
Was there a moment during the co-op when you knew, this is what I wanna do, or maybe on the other end of the spectrum where you questioned if this was the right thing for you?

Bobby Schuckmann: (12:05)
It was more of, I don't know, this is the right thing in this particular part of the industry that, that I want to do. Uh, obviously the commute made it, made it challenging enough, uh, then balancing some, you know, schoolwork and, and some, some part-time jobs and trying to have a social life. But it was really the, the grind of the, the day job itself, and then the nice, and then the weekends, and then really speaking with other, um, employees there and getting a background of where they are and what that took and maybe having some, um, genuine, you know, authentic conversations with them and advice that really helped me start thinking about things more and that, hey, this, I, I really love this experience, but maybe this isn't necessarily what I wanna hone my, my journey.

Grant Freking: (12:52)
Yeah. Do you have any other, like, memorable moments during the co-op experience besides, uh, pining around with the mascots?

Bobby Schuckmann: (12:58)
Yeah, so, um, you know, because of the, the commute on the way back, I was generally waiting for rush hour traffic to die down to, to drive back to Cincinnati. So, you know, at the, the, the Pacers practice courts, you know, with the, with the other interns and with the other staff, we would play pick up basketball games, you know, which is pretty fun to play games where the, the team actually, you know, the teams would practice. Um, they had a workout area you could go work out in as well. So it was fun to, to do those things. Um, you know, the, I guess kinda other fun part of that was my, um, I mentioned my wife was uc grad as well, and she was in the ballet program and she was coming off a hip injury, had hip surgery, was recovering from her surgery and rehab, and not able to dance anymore.

Bobby Schuckmann: (13:44)
So I encouraged her with the, the dance team tryouts happening with the Indiana Pace mates that she should audition. And she was not going to do it. She did not think that was what she, you know, would want it to do. She was a ballet dancer by trade, uh, all these years. And, uh, she ended up last minute, uh, auditioning for the Indiana Pace Mates and was the only new person that, uh, they brought onto the team that year. And so I ended up stopping my internship at the end of the summer, and then she started that, that commute as well as a uc student, uh, to, to drive there, um, even more often than I did for practice and for games. Um, and kind of a fun, uh, story with that was at the end they had, uh, my internship, they were doing the dance team, uh, team picture and the mascots were going to be in it, but the, the real mascot, uh, were not available that day. So myself and another, um, intern were asked to be, to dress up as being the mascot. So you can look back from this 2004 picture of the dance team photo with my wife in it, and then me, uh, in this mascot outfit with my, my shoes hanging out to identify me. So, um, it's been, we were just actually talking about that to somebody the other day and, uh, I need to track down that picture.

Grant Freking: (14:59)
Yeah, that's a fun story. So co-op was the starting point of your career. How did this grind open up doors for you immediately after or later on after you graduated?

Bobby Schuckmann: (15:12)
Yeah, so I, I continued to pursue more sports, uh, co-ops and internships and really trying to find what I enjoyed doing. Um, and was actually through a sports marketing class at uc that I, I was told about that a, uh, a sports agent and attorney was teaching, and I started to do some work for him, um, on the sports agency side, working with an indi, you know, individual players on, on more of the marketing. And I really enjoyed the business side of, of what that entailed and, and really helping the athletes with everything off the, the court or the field. And that actually got me start thinking more, I like working more with the individuals as, as opposed to maybe working on the team side of the sport. Um, again, very hard, uh, industry to, to get in. Um, but I was able to to, to do that.

Bobby Schuckmann: (15:58)
And that really got me start thinking more about what I want to do, um, in the sports space. Um, probably even a harder area, you know, to, to get into. And it was through some of those internships where I saw how hard it was to get clients in the space. So it's one thing to be very good at your job, to have all the skills and all the experience in the world, but you have to find people that are willing to hire you and pay you. And I saw how hard that, that really, really was, which then tempered my, my interest in, in possibly going the sports agent route. Um, so the fact that I'm in wealth management today, it's still very similar with having to find clients that want to trust you and trust you with their, their life savings. Um, but it was through those experiences, I had a better appreciation for what I was getting into in my career today.

Grant Freking: (16:41)
And so how did you ascend from taking the possible agent path to the wealth path to where you are now? How did that maybe winding journey get you to where you are now?

Bobby Schuckmann: (16:51)
So after all these experiences that I, that I had, it came back to who do you know? And I didn't know enough people, and I really thought the journey of being in sports business was going to stop at graduation before it would even get started. Um, and it was through my uc, uh, network and fraternity network that I reached out to anyone I could, that I was looking for a job. Um, and it was through my fraternity brother Jay, who was working at US Bank and their wealth group, and I said, Jay, I'm looking for a job. You know who I am, you know, my experience, you know, you know hard of a worker I am. And he said, we have a sports entertainment group here that I never heard of, even though it was in my own city. And they're looking to hire someone, they have a, they have an opening, um, for someone that looks, looks like you would be a great fit. And so it was me doing all this work and thinking that this was maybe not the right approach. , right? This was this all for nothing. And because of my network and because of, of going to uc, um, and the connections that I built there and the friendships that I built and reaching out for people for help that I was able to, to land on at US Bank and their sports group, um, outta college.

Grant Freking: (18:04)
Let's move into some lessons for audience, maybe more specifically for current or prospective students. From your perspective, what were, what are the key factors of reaching your career goals or, and perhaps even broad broadening it out to more of a wider audience of our current students and perspective students?

Bobby Schuckmann: (18:22)
I definitely encourage you pursuing your dreams. I, I would say, you know, listen to the people around you as well that have perspectives. You know, they're not trying to diminish what you wanna achieve, but they're, you know, you're, you're trying to get experience from, from all, uh, of, of parts of, of someone's journey, right? And so I think that was something where, again, it, it ended up working out for me, but I was maybe a little naive to, to the fact of, of what this may that may truly be. And, um, again, I'm happy that it did work out, but I think when I speak to a lot of students, uh, today, uh, whether it be, you know, in front of 'em in person or just phone calls that I'll take, I really encourage them to find the, the true skills and role that they, that they really are good at and that they enjoy.

Bobby Schuckmann: (19:06)
Um, you can always specialize in something later. I know accountants that specialize working with athletes and entertainers. I know I have clients that broker cars and find, you know, the, the right car and, um, you know, for celebrities and, and, and athletes. I, um, you know, people in the culinary arts that, that work in this space. So you can always find a way to specialize later. And the specialization may be 'cause you're really good at it and you're having success, or maybe I'm just having success over here and that's where I should really specialize. And when I went and, and in turn for the Pacers, I thought I'm going to get a good job, or hopefully a great job someday in business. I went to uc and to Lindner to get a business degree and a job and hopefully earn a a, a good living. And someday I'll just buy my own tickets to the event. I won't have to work the event itself. And so I, I am, I'm very happy that I, within all the exciting things I, I was able to do, I still tried to keep a, a future mindset of where I wanted to be, you know, in the next five, 10 or 15 years, not knowing what the job may be. But I did not want sports to get in the way of not taking advantage of, of my uc, um, you know, business degree.

Grant Freking: (20:16)
Sure. Aside from keeping that future mindset that you just mentioned, what other habits did, did you develop or that maybe even still practice today that helped you stay focused on your goals?

Bobby Schuckmann: (20:26)
The, the willingness and, and to, to always keep learning? Uh, you know, I think a lot, a lot myself included, you know, went to to college, it was the next thing that you did and you kind of did it 'cause you feel you had to, uh, to some extent. Um, all, all of the things I've done post uc be because I want to do it. Um, so I've gone on to, to graduate school for my MBA part-time over a two year program. I've done two different, uh, financial, uh, you know, planning and wealth management programs and, and gotten my, uh, certified financial planner and certified private wealth advisor designations. So you, you never stop learning, you know, I'm listening to the podcast quite often on I'm various topics, um, some very technical, some more general that you can probably relay to your client a lot easier.

Bobby Schuckmann: (21:08)
Um, I do a lot of reading, whether it be books or just, um, you know, the, the news in the morning. Um, so I think the, the willingness and desire to, and to, to always want to keep learning, I think has been, been fun for me. I enjoy it. And, you know, there's the very exciting time and I also have to know what my clients are interested in. Um, you know, the, the industry and, and the, the, the world I grew up in is, you know, I have to remind myself now I'm, you know, my, my kids are closer in age to some of the clients that I work with. And so, um, I think the, the, the willingness and desire, uh, to, to always keep learning and, and, uh, to be curious, I think is what's benefited me

Grant Freking: (21:44)
Be a lifelong learner. That is, that is great advice. So what's one thing maybe students should stop worrying about so much you think during their, their time in college and or, and what's one thing that maybe they should take a little bit more seriously?

Bobby Schuckmann: (22:00)
Things are going to work out the way they're supposed to eventually. Uh, there's no straight line to your success. Um, there's no, there's no linear path to, to get to where you want to go. You know, even going to college is a great opportunity to find out a lot about yourself, about what you think you want to do. Um, trying to, to pick a major when you're 17, 18, 19 years old, um, is, it's a great start. But you know, you can be open to, uh, some opportunities if you kind of put it out there that you don't need to be sued. So narrow focused, um, you know, there's a lot of adversity. Uh, there's a lot of of things. So there's gonna be self-doubt. Um, even in, you know, in my, in my own career, you know, today, you know, imposter syndrome can, can definitely, uh, make itself present a lot of times.

Bobby Schuckmann: (22:44)
And, but, but I think that also makes you successful when you, when you don't get satisfied, you don't get complacent. So, um, don't be too hard on yourself. Um, things are gonna work out the way that they need to. Um, and, and don't be afraid to ask for help. There are so many people out there, uh, that want to that, that wanna help you, but they don't wake up every day thinking about how they can help you. You have to go in and find them, uh, with, you know, myself included. Um, you know, I think when it comes to putting in the work, um, if you put in the work while you're, you're younger, you maybe have less things going on in your life and you can kind of maximize your, your, your time, still have time for a social life, still have time for your family and the things that you wanna pursue.

Bobby Schuckmann: (23:23)
But if you put in the work when you're younger, it's, it's no different than the investing space is the, the more money that you can put away early on that the time value of that is gonna give you way more optionality and flexibility later. So, uh, the more you can do now while you're in school, the first several years of your career, you know, once you maybe have a family, once you, once you maybe have other, uh, responsibilities that are gonna pop, pop up, um, it gets harder and harder to do that. So, you know, work life balance I know is very important to a lot of people, but the more work you do while you can early on, it gives you way more optionality to have that balance that you want later, uh, in your career, in your family life.

Grant Freking: (23:59)
Last one, before I let you go from your unique position in the sports business world, what has being in this space taught you about people, about business and about leadership?

Bobby Schuckmann: (24:10)
Everyone starts in very similar positions. Um, we all started, you know, maybe having a dream to be in, in the sports industry. Um, maybe that wasn't even something we even thought about, um, until later on. Um, you know, I think with the, the Pacers internship, I was able to carve out some time with the chief, uh, marketing officer as well as the CFO. And I learned that they did not start in the mail room and work their way up. They got jobs in finance, they got jobs in marketing and entertainment, and eventually found their way, um, and that point in their career to the Pacers. So I think that was very enlightening that, um, go get your experience wherever you can get it, and you, you can wind up where you want to later on. I think given that some of the, the folks that I work with and, and maybe the high profileness of them, they're all just people.

Bobby Schuckmann: (24:54)
They're, they're all just people trying to figure it out who have a great opportunity, who maybe a little more pressure than the average 20 or 30-year-old to get it right the first time. But everyone is out there with the same experiences, with the same struggles. Um, you know, money can help alleviate some of those things, but it doesn't take away many of them. And it's been, it reminding to me that we're all, we're all the same, whether you went to uc or you went to, you know, uh, an Ivy League school, um, we all had the same opportunities. We all, uh, if we work hard and we, you know, get a little luck along the way. And, um, same thing I was telling some uc students that were down in Atlanta, uh, back in in December, is that we can compete with anybody. Um, you know, I'm a a proven success, success story of that. I have tons and tons of friends who have better stories than my own. And that uc is a, a phenomenal place to go. That the amount of resources that they have today, uh, with the leadership that is there is, is phenomenal. And, uh, it just really makes me proud to be a Bearcat.

Grant Freking: (25:57)
Bobby Schuckmann's path from unpaid Pacers co-op to a career in sports proves that grit, focus and saying yes to tough opportunities can change everything. For him, co-op wasn't just an experience, it was the foundation for lasting success. Thanks for tuning in the Bearcats Business. Be sure to subscribe. Leave a review and share this episode with someone who's ready to take the leap. Your feedback helps more Bearcats discover the show. Until next time, keep showing the world how Bearcat Mean Business.